MTM - Interview with Joe Wolverton..Who is the Fabian Society

A quiet revolution is still a revolution, especially when it arrives through classrooms, committees, and “reasonable” rules that nobody voted on. We talk with constitutional lawyer Joe Wolverton about the Fabian Society and the idea of slow-motion political change: not a dramatic overthrow, but a steady reshaping of how people think, speak, and comply.

We dig into the Fabian method of building power through institutions, from universities to civil service, and why credentialed “experts” can become a substitute for the consent of the governed. Joe explains the symbolism, the long game behind “make haste slowly”, and why modern governance often feels like management by unelected planners. We also connect the dots to the administrative state, the Council on Foreign Relations as an American counterpart, and the way regulations can function like binding law in daily life.

A big part of the story is language. When definitions of free speech, rights, sovereignty, and even what “keep and bear arms” means are detached from their constitutional roots, the public conversation changes without most people noticing. We also examine how incremental reforms get framed as necessities, not choices, and why tools like digital currency raise concerns about future control through permissioned spending.

If you care about constitutional rights, civic literacy, and protecting self-government, you’ll leave with a clear challenge and practical next steps: grow in virtue, get educated, and organise with like-minded people. Subscribe, share this with a friend, and leave a review with the biggest idea you’re still wrestling with.

Transcript

Welcome And Show Setup

SPEAKER_01 0:04

Welcome to More Than Medicine, where Jesus is more than enough for the ill, the plague, our culture, and the people. Hosted by authoring physician Dr. Robert Jackson. And his wife Carlotta and Daughter Annabelle. So listen up because the doctor is dead.

SPEAKER_02 0:22

Welcome to More Than Medicine. I'm your host, Dr. Robert Jackson, bringing to you biblical insights and stories from the country doctor's rusty, dusty scrapbook. Well, today I'm delighted to once again have as my guest Joe Wolverton, who is a constitutional lawyer. Joe's been my guest before, and I'm delighted to have him again. Joe, welcome to More Than Medicine.

SPEAKER_03 0:46

Thank you, Doctor. I'm happy to be with you as always. It's uh it's one of the best podcasts that I ever do regularly, is yours because it's so filled with the spirit, and it and you know we can't teach if we don't have the spirit.

SPEAKER_02 0:57

I hear you, I hear you. Well, I read an article recently, Joe, that you wrote in The New American about the Fabian Society. And I'm gonna have to admit that I did not really understand who or what the Fabian Society was, and I have to admit that whenever I had heard references to the Fabian Society in conservative circles, it it was always in a pejorative sort of way. And it wasn't until I read your article that I began to fully understand

Why The Fabian Society Matters

SPEAKER_02 1:33

who they were and what they were about. So I'm indebted to you for helping me out with the understanding who they were and what they were all about. And as soon as I I read the article, I said, I got to have him back on on my podcast, and he's gonna have to help my listeners understand uh who the Fabians are. So here's here's my three questions for you, and then I'm gonna just turn you loose, okay? Number one, who and what is the Fabian Society? What is their end game? What's their goals? And then what is their strategy? And we got about 25 minutes, so you wax eloquent if you don't mind, and just answer those three questions for me and my listeners.

SPEAKER_04 2:20

I'll do it, I'll do my best at it.

Origins Of Fabian Slow Politics

SPEAKER_04 2:22

How about that? Well, you had uh so the Fabians were founded in 1884. Okay, and that's an important year to remember because one of the most famous books written by a Fabian is 1984 by George Orwell. Now, people think people think he just grabbed that date, it's a future date. No, he reckoned that it would take them a hundred years to gain control of England and America. So he named his book. It wasn't meant to be a uh a warning, it was meant to be a uh guide of how to go about doing this, right? Because the Fabians, their idea is to, they don't support revolutions, uh, you know, violent eruptions of the people against the leaders. They don't support that. And they reckon that such revolutions don't aren't really successful in English-speaking countries because we're uh we're accustomed to the rule of law, to constitutions, uh bills of rights, things like that. So an uprising is not really the sort of thing you see in English-speaking countries, in your Anglophone countries. However, they reckon that the most effective way to do that is to proceed quietly using committees in the government, university professors, commissions, and then lower education to redefine words so that they would not have the meaning that originally they did. For example, if you tell someone, you know, you have the right of free speech. Well, as you've seen, we have from elementary school on through the universities, kids are taught that you can't free speech is fine, but you can't say something that will hurt another person's feelings or trigger them or upset them. Well, that's fine because that's in reality, hate speech, as they call it today, is exactly the kind of speech the First Amendment was designed to protect, right? It was designed to protect the government from interfering with your ability to criticize the government, right? So the Fabians, their idea is, well, we're matter of fact, their their slogan in Latin is festina festina lente, which means make haste but slowly. Oh you can't really make haste slowly, but that's their idea is generationally. They're not in a hurry. Like just like 1984, they're not in a hurry, right? Their idea is we don't need to, what would you say, like, um, confront people. We just need to condition them, right? We need to change their understanding of what good government is. So not consent of the governed. They they they have no concept of consent of the governed. To them, they think it's you know more effective, and they've proven themselves right, that instead of consent of the governed, they have uh rule by the elite. You get credentialed experts, economists, planners, administrators, and their authority doesn't come from the consent of the governed, but it comes from some technical competence that they're perceived to have. And so you have things like uh the World Economic Forum, right? Where these people, they their all of their credibility is found in their credentials. And their credentials are achieved uh by by appealing to people of their same ilk. So you you become president of this, you become board member of that, and those accolades, those credentials, people are being conditioned to believe that if you're credentialed and you're an expert, then your opinion matters more than anybody else's.

Wolf In Sheep’s Clothing Strategy

SPEAKER_04 6:22

That's right. And the Fabians were like, well, the way we do this is we just got to get control of the colleges. So the London School of Economics is where they started uh really uh their goal of uh taking over all the free, all the English-speaking governments. And they thought, and to the well, I guess I should say why the Fabians, two things, because I think this is important for people to know. Number one, their original symbol was a wolf in sheep's clothes. Like if you go to the London School, you can go online and if you look, you can look up the Fabian window at the London School of Economics, and you'll see it's a stained glass window, and you'll see their original logo is a wolf in sheep's clothing. And they've got the earth on an anvil and they're beating it out. And so that's their thing. They're wolfing, that's their whole goal. Be a wolf in sheep's clothing. Make people think this is progress, make people think that this is liberalism, make people think that this is somehow uh you're freer, right? Under good managers rather than being self-governing. Because to them, they don't want this is the thing, Doc. They don't want to do away with democracy. They just want to manage the democra democracy. They don't want to, you know, do away with your concept of civil liberty. They just want to have their people in charge of managing it. I understand. I understand. And the reason, the reason they're called Fabians, by the way, is they named themselves after the famous Roman general uh Fabian Fabius Maximus, who he got the nickname Concator, which means delayer, because the Romans, uh Hannibal was, you know, within miles of the gates of Rome, and uh general uh Fabius, he was able to delay uh Hannibal, and he didn't he didn't like take him on in fierce battle and beat him. He just it was a war of attrition. He just wore him down, and that's what the Fabians I mean, they don't hide, you see. They their symbol is a wolf in sheep's clothing, and their their uh the namesake is a guy that just wore down Hannibal. War of attrition, and that's what they want to do to us. They think that normal people, you and me, are not capable of governing ourselves. They think that rational, in their in their words, rational administration is the best way to keep people free. And we, of course, do not believe that. But they have a they know that if they just presented this in its open, purest form, that people would reject it for the most part. English speaking people, for the most part, would reject Marxist doctrine, right? But they said we can do this incrementally, slowly, and we can normalize all that today would seem revolutionary. We can normalize it if we get control of schools and we get control of government. And their thought, if we can control those two things, we got the world. And they're willing to wait as long as they need to to achieve that insidious design. And we see it today. We see today that it's not, it's how would I say it? It's not just like policy. You can't say that's a Fabian policy, that's a Fabian policy. Because it's more than a policy, it's it's it's an intellectual machinery that is trying to remake the world after its own desires. And the Fabians are all over the place, Doc. Keir Starmer's a Fabian, Sadiq Khan, the mayor of London, is a Fabian. Uh we got several members of parliament currently that are Fabians. And they they produce, this is a weird thing, Doc, and I encourage your listeners to go and look. They produce a newsletter, the Fabian newsletter, where they brag about this stuff. They don't hide it. You know, they brag. And right across the top it says Festina Lente, you know, make haste slowly. And they spread their work out and they do it in the most insidious but unfortunately clever and effective way. And that is through schools and through government. Because if they can promise someone power, then that person is willing to do what it takes to get that thing. And it's, you know, it's they can promise that because they have people in power right now who can elevate those who are willing to adopt the Fabian uh policies. I got you, right? If you can prove that you're willing to do that, then they have people like Keir Starmer and others who will elevate you, right? So they they used England as their testing ground, right? Uh and it had and you can look over at England and you can see today the effect of fabulous. There's no way. So I lived in England as a kid and when I was 16, I guess. And there is no way that you could go back in time and ask 16-year-old me, uh, you know, describe England today and have me believe you, right? Because it would be, it's so far from the England that I knew. And that's by design. That's how they meant it to be. Slowly, incrementally do it through the institutions that already exist without needing a revolution. We don't need a revolution, they said. Not like this. We need, and in their words, a reformation. We need to reform people into better workers. We need to reform people into being uh more less devoted to liberty than they are to safety and ease. And so they just started working that and like they George Bernard Shaw, for example, he's one of the founders, and he wrote, I'll quote him here, he says, the Fabian society consists of socialists who are determined to get socialism introduced by stealth. Now, if you'd I mean, think about it. 20 years ago, if you'd asked me, would there ever be an openly avowed socialist mayor of New York City? I would say, you're crazy. Well, today we have that, and we have several elected officials who are openly avowed socialists. And why how all of a sudden did that take place? Well, it's not all of a sudden. They've been working at this for years, and they're on a political trajectory that will take us right into serfdom, Doc.

Modern Results And Digital Control

SPEAKER_04 13:12

It will get take us right into slavery, right into rule, absolute rule by this uh this plutocracy, this oligarchy. There will be a few men at the top who rule everything, and the rest of us will have to make sure and confine ourselves within the limits of the authority they give us. Otherwise, they will punish us in every possible way because they will have gained control slowly and stealthily, as he said, of all the institutions. Take today, right? If you get this uh central digital currency, well, you realize that you you can't go down and buy a hundred rounds ammunition. They'll turn your money off. They'll say, you can buy 20 rounds a year and that's it. And so you go to pay at Walmart or whatever, and they say, Oh, you don't have any money, because the money will now be in all this digital currency, and the switch, whether it's on or off, will be there in the hands of these bureaucrats. And they won't be elected, they won't be answerable to the people, there will be no way for the people to hold them accountable for their acts, and you'll just have to agree to suffer. And this is their goal. They don't care if it takes another hundred years, if they are able to do it. And I don't think it will take them another hundred years because they're doing such a good job of it now. And we are, you know, fast-tracked on that trajectory toward this totalitarian-style government, like the kind you read. So you read 1984, there you go. You're reading exactly what they want the future to be. And if you remember the end of 1984, you got your guy there in the two plus two, you know, and he's resisted saying that two plus two is five, and at the very end, he he, you know, admits that it's five. And that's their goal, see. Their goal is just break everyone down slowly, by attrition, outlast everybody, right?

Four Tools Of Fabian Power

SPEAKER_04 15:07

And they have three mechan, well, I guess four main mechanisms that they use to accomplish this demonic goal. First, they capture the institutions, they establish footholds in education, civil service, policy development, right? So you'd you wouldn't have a president, for example, in the United States come out and say, I'm a Fabian. But you'd have one of these executive branch uh departments where the bureaucrats are all Fabians. Well, I let me say this. Fabian's is the name they used in England. When they transported it, when they exported it to the United States, they set up an American sister of the Fabian Society, and in the United States, they called it the Council on Foreign Relations because they reckon nobody's gonna know what Fabian is in America. Americans are too dumb to know who Fabian is, you know, to know what uh Maxim Fabius Maximus, who he is. So we're gonna call it something that sounds, you know, less owner, less uh, less threatening. The Council on Foreign Relations. That, my friend, is the American sister of the Fabian Society, and they have the same goal. And if you look, if you go to the New Americans uh recent conspiracy for global control, and there is a pullout in there, if you go and get that magazine, you pull out the center part there, it shows all the people in government that are in the Council on Foreign Relations, and it will astonish you.

SPEAKER_02 16:40

Yeah, it astonished me.

SPEAKER_04 16:41

I read it carefully. Yeah, people think that, well, what does that matter? Who cares that they're, you know, what if they were all members of the Rotary Club? Who cares? Well, you say that the Rotary Club doesn't have a political agenda. And second of all, I tell people this, I said, okay, so let's imagine right now that the number of bureaucrats who are in the CFR or the Fabians overseas, you know, if that number is, let's just say, put it low, 20% of all the bureaucrats. Now, listen, you gotta realize not the politicians, not the elected officials, they don't care about them. Because the way they are getting their business done is filling all the offices of government with their people and training, conditioning Americans to believe that there is this fourth branch of government, the bureaucracy, and to really look at these federal codes and regulations as binding law when, by every definition ever acceptable by any English-speaking person, it would not be considered law. Because the lawmaker must be accountable to the governed. He must be able to be removed by the governed, he must represent the governed, he must be elected by the governed. Well, they don't care about any of that because they have conditioned us to think that these federal regulations are binding as law. And so their idea is: look, we don't have to have a president come out and say he's a member of the CFR, although we have had presidents who are in the CFR. But we don't need that. All we do is need to make sure that we can get our guys credentialed and get them to occupy seats of authority in the bureaucracy. And we have that today, right? For example, I'll give you one quick example. The regulation that says you can't drink raw milk. Now, that's there's never been a law passed like that. It's a bureaucrat, it's something that the bureaucracy did. They made it a regulation. But everybody, if you ask everybody, you know, in in most states, it's still illegal to buy and sell and drink raw milk. And if you ask people why they don't do it, they'll say, oh, it's against the law. You see, we've already been conditioned to think that whatever regulation the federal government puts out, that that's binding on us. I mean, that's and that's their thing. Capture the institutions.

Redefining Rights Through Education

SPEAKER_04 19:12

The second thing they want to do is change the language. Redefine terms. What does freedom mean? What does rights mean? What does popular sovereignty mean? Detach them from their original meanings and reattach them to the meanings that the controllers want you to have. And that's what school is. You know, you you have, I've taught at university, and I used to have this thing in my law class at university where I would show these kids uh textbooks that were been approved for high school. And the way these textbooks define things, they are they are, like Alexander Hamilton said, they are defining them out of existence. That's right. That's right. So you ask somebody what keeping their arms mean, you literally have, if you went out and you asked somebody randomly in school, you know, some 16, 70-year-old, they would say, well, it means the police and the army can have weapons. That's right. That's not at all what it means. Or they might say, it's protect your right to hunt and provide for your family. That is not at all what it means. And no founding father would have voted for that if that's what it meant, right? What it means is you, the security of a free country is only guaranteed by an armed citizenry. And that's what it means. Because if you read Federalist 46, for example, Madison says, at the end of the day, if every protection against tyranny falls and fails, at the end of the day, he said, you'll have millions of American men who own guns and know how to use them. That's right. And he, you know, he didn't want that to happen, but he was, you know, his study of history gave him enough foresight to see that, you know, republics, if the people aren't virtuous, they are not going to be comfortable in a republican form of government. Because they don't want to define freedom and rights and sovereignty the way our founding fathers did. They want to find freedom means do whatever you like, whenever you like. And if someone doesn't like it, that's tough. But then what do they say? Oh, but if you do something that we don't like, then you're canceled and you can't speak and you lose your job and you get fired. And who's deciding that? Well, the people in government are deciding that because what happened in the late 1800s when the federal government took control of education, they started slowly, incrementally changing these textbooks. And you can see them. You I have a collection, you can look at textbooks over time and see the way that they've changed the definition of things. So that, you know, if you go to school, you start school when you're five or six, by the time you're 18. You've been indoctrinated. That's right. You don't have the definition of freedom and liberty that our founding fathers intended.

SPEAKER_02 22:08

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 22:09

So that's their second thing. Get control of the language.

Incremental Reforms Sold As Necessary

SPEAKER_04 22:12

The third thing is what they call incrementalism. You don't transform a society overnight, and it's not one policy that's going to accomplish it. You have to have little modest and defensible reforms, right? A revolution wouldn't be able to accomplish that, but we don't need fires and barricades and open, you know, armed rebellion. We don't need that. We can get to the same end peacefully. And even more, it'll be the people themselves will support it. And today, Doc, look at, I mean, you think about socialism in all its many forms. We absolutely are not a free market economy. We are not that. They have successfully turned us into a socialist economy, right? They have done this slowly, incrementally. And the next, the last thing that they use. So you got first is they get the institutions, the colleges, the schools, the bureaucracy. Second, transform the language. Make these words mean something different. Third, do this through a sequence of reforms that are modest and defensible, right? This is just reasonable gun control, right? That's the sort of thing they'll say. Well, we can't, you know, we can't have people dying in the streets. You know what I'm saying? You know, that'll be their thing. We can't have children dying at school. And so you'll think to yourself, well, that is reasonable. We can't have kids dying in school. So we need to do pass this reasonable gun reform. Even the NRA supports reasonable gun control. Yeah. And so that's their that's their uh third thing, incrementalism, let's call it. And the fourth, they present all of their policies not as choices, but as necessities. Yes. Right? This isn't what we're we don't necessarily, we wish we could do it differently, but you look at all the violence, there's nothing we can do about it. We have got to restrict the right to own certain weapons. Right? It's a necessity. And then you get, if you oppose any of that, why, you know, you're called a radical, you're called um a a conservative, whatever, you know, whatever name they can fit to you. Yeah, but they just want to make sure that you seem impractical and outdated. That's right. Because the stuff they're proposing, you see, is reasonable and necessary.

unknown 24:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 24:49

And through these mechanisms, they have been able, the Fabians in England and the Council on Foreign Relations in America, to achieve what overt coercion could not achieve. They get compliance without confrontation.

unknown 25:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 25:05

You know, people always say, why don't people rising up in the streets about this stuff? Well, first of all, we've been taught that that's not right to do. Second of all, we don't know what the definition of the word law is. We don't know the Declaration of Independence, we don't know the Constitution, right? Except vaguely. And when you ask someone, what's in the Constitution? Uh the right to keep and bear arms, uh, freedom of speech, that's the Bill of Rights. That's not even the original Constitution, right? You ask somebody what due process of law means. Well, I don't know. You ask somebody, did you know the Constitution says we can't use paper money? And they'll be like, no, it doesn't. We use paper money. The government issues it. No, the government does not issue it. It's an independent agency that was created for the purpose of enslaving us monetarily. And they've done a good job of it, right? Yeah. And so this, they get you to comply because, man, it's just reasonable gun control. We got so many people sick from drinking raw milk, we need to cut down on this. And the people, I now, having gone through all the institutions of learning and higher learning, they they complied because they've been conditioned to believe all of this stuff. And it's been Doc so many generations now that there's hardly anyone alive who remembers before there was a council on foreign relations.

SPEAKER_02 26:26

You're right.

SPEAKER_04 26:27

Right? There's no one alive who remembers education before the federal government started interfering with it. And if you go back and read, for example, the speeches given by people in favor of federal education, reform, because that's all they ever call it, is reform. You know, you got to make it seem sensible, got to make it defensible, got to make it, you know, where everybody will support it. And you go back and you read the speeches of these people supporting government-controlled schools, and you see that they say, look, we're falling behind every other country in our education. So we need to have qualified teachers because too many of these kids, our kids, American kids, are being taught at home by parents who are ignorant. So we need what we need to do is take teachers and give them credentials and make it the law where people have to send their kids to school, to credentialed teachers, credentialed schools, all of this. And look where we are now. Over 90% of American kids are taught in government-controlled schools. And the Fabians and the Council on Foreign Relations, which is their American counterpart, they they just look at the Constitution as an obstacle to efficiency. They care about efficiency more than they care about liberty. In fact, they don't care about liberty at all. They overlook most of that if they can get your liberty to fit within the boundaries that they set for it. Right? And like the founding fathers, they learn from a study of history. Gosh, you can go all the way back, you can go to the Spartans, the Athenians, you go to the Bible, and you read of Republican with a small R, republican forms of government. And what does that mean? That means the people rule through elected representatives and you divide up the power so that we have what we call checks and balances, right? So one group of people can't accomplish some great revolution of government. Well, but think about it now. Now we don't really believe in a separation of powers. You've got executive orders and Supreme Court opinions that everybody and his dog will claim is the law. When the Supreme Court said, hey, you need to start murdering babies, everybody thought suddenly that that was the law, right? When the Supreme Court says, well, uh two men can be married, everybody thought, well, not to do it.

unknown 29:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:02

All right. Well, we're gonna run out of time.

How Citizens Push Back

SPEAKER_02 29:05

Tell us what in the world can we do to check all of this as private citizens.

SPEAKER_04 29:12

Well, I think that the the first thing we have to do, and this is the the thing I always say, is there is no liberty without virtue. We cannot have a government of this of the sort established by our founding fathers if we do not square away our individual virtue, right? We've got to make sure that we are doing the right thing, even when it's hard. We've and you cannot, so that's the first thing, your virtue. Second thing, you got to get educated, right? Because Jefferson warned us if you want to be ignorant and free, you want what never was and never will be. So we've got to be virtuous, which means moral, religious. Get yourself to church on Sunday, right? Start praying, start repenting, start getting yourself in line with the will of God. The second thing, get yourself educated. And the third thing is join with like-minded people. So to me, and you the proof is in the pudding, since the 60s, well, the late 50s, the John Burch Society has been opposing the Council on Foreign Relations and exposing it. And we've got to do that. But exposing them doesn't mean anything if people don't know why it matters that there's a, you know, this insidious group in charge of the bureaucracy, right? Yep. They they adapt themselves to whatever they what other shape, right? A wolf in sheep's clothes. So get yourself morally squared away, get yourself educated, join with like-minded people because if we submit to this, I mean that's really our only choice, right, Doc? We either submit to this managed decline under unelected planners and bureaucrats, or we join the effort to restore self-government through education, organization, and lawful resistance. That's right. Compl complaining about the administrative state while refusing to oppose it, that's just surrender by another name. That's right. That's right. Don't sit there and accept it, man. You cannot accept it. History is shaped by those who refuse to yield to these schemers in these elite councils. That's right. We can't we can't be spectators anymore. The work of restoration belongs to the informed, the courageous, and the committed. And God, like the good book says, many are called, but few are chosen. So I have I have news for everyone born in this country. You're chosen because you were born in the freest country ever devised.

unknown 31:42

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 31:43

You were born in a country where your liberty is still at least to some degree protected. So you were called and you were chosen, and now you've got to step up and you've got to do what our fathers did. And the way we do that is by reading the things they read, becoming educated.

Education Resources And Joining Up

SPEAKER_04 32:02

And then the John Burke Society has a chapter in every town. Yep. And the thing about it is you go and you join it and you instantly have access to resources that you never would have thought available, and you can get yourself educated real quickly. I mean, I I could tell you the uh I'm in charge of the publishing at the John Burke Society, and you go on there to Western Islands Publishing.com and you go there and we have bundles. You can just one click and you can get the Founding Fathers bundle. One click you can get a library of liberty, and we have them priced that anybody can afford them.

SPEAKER_03 32:34

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 32:35

Because our idea is not to make money, our idea is to make patriots. And we know the way to do that is through education and through the you know encouragement of a moral religious society. And so you've got to you've got to say to yourself, is it, you know, if not me, who? If not now, when? If not here, where?

SPEAKER_02 32:57

Uh people have been asking me for years, Dr. Jackson, how do you know all these things? And I tell them, it's because I read The New American. And I've been reading it for, I don't know, 40 years, uh, back when it was still the review of the news. And um, so um I I encourage my listeners, read The New American. Uh order some of these books that Joe was talking about, and and like he said, you need to be a part of the solution, uh, not just be uninformed and uninvolved. Uh be a member of the John Birch Society, be a part of the solution, and uh and just continue to be on the on the learning curve.

SPEAKER_04 33:37

Yeah, it's not and it's not just affiliation, you know, it's not just joining a club. It's your way of showing the enemies of freedom that we will not let their them go unchallenged. That's right.

SPEAKER_02 33:50

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 33:50

And as the as the as the old hymn says, Doc, who's on the Lord's side who? That's right. That's right. Now is the time.

SPEAKER_02 33:58

Now is the time. And you want to be a patriot. You don't want to be just a reader, you want to be an involved patriot.

SPEAKER_04 34:06

That's right. You don't want to be just a hearer of the word, you want to be a doer as well.

SPEAKER_02 34:10

That's right. Now, time's up, Joe. I hate to hate to cut you off because I know you're a fountain of information, but I gotta go now. I'm a fountain of some part. That's right. All right, you're

Final Blessing And Contact Info

SPEAKER_02 34:20

listening to More Than Medicine. Uh I'm your host, Dr. Robert Jackson. My guest today is Joe Wolverton, a constitutional lawyer and part of the publishing arm for uh Western Islands, uh, which is a subdivision of the John Burch Society. Joe, I really, really appreciate you being my guest today.

SPEAKER_04 34:38

Well, Doc, as you know, it's my great honor and privilege to be with you.

SPEAKER_02 34:42

All right. Thank you, sir. We'll be back again next week. Until then, may the Lord bless you real good, and just remember, Jesus loves you and your doctor loves you.

SPEAKER_00 34:55

Thank you for listening to this of more than medicine. For more information about the Doctor Family Ministry or to schedule a speaker, go to Instagram, Doctor Family Ministry.