More Than Medicine
More Than Medicine
From Despair to Redemption: Bruce Plummer's Journey of Faith and Transformation (Part Two)
Can someone's darkest moments truly be a path to light? Bruce Plummer returns to our podcast to share a riveting account of how he found salvation amidst despair. From wrestling with anger and homelessness to a failed suicide attempt, Bruce’s story is nothing short of transformative. Discover how a chance encounter with Pastor Gibb and the powerful message of John 3:16 illuminated his path to redemption, setting the stage for a profound inner change. Bruce candidly discusses how acknowledging his sins and seeking forgiveness altered the course of his life, offering a profound lesson on the transformative power of faith.
Witness a life changed by faith as Bruce recounts his spiritual awakening and miraculous cure from alcoholism. His new journey led him to Oklahoma Baptist University and the First Indian Baptist Church, paving the way for a devoted ministry. Inspired by Henry Blackaby, Bruce eventually returned to his home reservation, dedicating over 22 years to spreading the gospel through Fry Bread Fellowship Ministries. Through heartfelt personal stories, he shares the impactful spiritual work accomplished among America's indigenous people, offering a moving testament to God's boundless love and grace. Tune in to hear how Bruce’s unwavering faith continues to inspire and transform lives.
https://www.montanaindianministries.org/
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https://bobslone.com/home/podcast-production/
Welcome to More Than Medicine. I'm your host, dr Robert Jackson, bringing to you biblical insights and stories from the country doctor's rusty, dusty scrapbook. Well, I'm delighted once again this week to have Bruce Plummer with me. We started off with his story last week and again we're going to finish up where we left off. So, bruce, welcome to More Than Medicine.
Speaker 2:I'm glad to be here again. I appreciate the opportunity.
Speaker 1:Well, last week we finished with your testimony and I want us to back up a little bit because some of my listeners probably were not here last week. So, Bruce, if you don't mind, I want you to go backwards in time a little bit in your story to where you were in the home of Pastor Gibb. Did I say that right?
Speaker 2:Gibb, yeah Gibb.
Speaker 1:Oh, Pastor Gibb, Okay, and just share with them the crisis point in your life where he and his family were sharing the gospel with you and you made your profession of faith in his home. If you don't mind, go back in time to there and then let's go forward from there.
Speaker 2:Okay, all right. Well, I sure appreciate the opportunity to share what God has done for me in my life. And some time ago I read a book from Mark Tw Twain, and he was a great philosopher and he had once said that the two greatest days in any individual's life is the day they were born and the day that they found out why. And I've always pondered on that thing because that makes to me it made a whole lot of sense, because I don't remember the day I was born, but I'm really happy that my mother had me. I was born on the Fort Balnup Indian Reservation in north central Montana in 1952. And 21 years later, after going through kind of a crazy lifestyle and kind of a radical left-wing angry young Indian man, going through an attempt of suicide and meeting this friend of mine who took me into his home just to talk to me, I found out the reason why I was born. And that concept of Mark Twain has ever stuck in my head, because the most two important days of my life have been the day that I was born and the day that I found out why. And the day that I found out why In February of 1973, I had been discussing the issues of my life, of being an Indian, an indigenous person that lives in the United States, and all that happened to us. I was angry and frustrated and disappointed with the government, the way they had treated my people for these last hundreds of years. Anyway, to make a long story short, I was in his house and he had kept sharing the gospel with me and one of the most amazing things is he shared a scripture that actually went into my heart and I began to grasp and read it and God began to grow that scripture in my heart and that was John 3.16, because he said, for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believes in him should not perish but have everlasting life. Now, I had always believed in the Creator. Like I explained in my testimony before, there's never been a time in my life that I didn't know there was a Creator. Romans in the first chapter talks about you cannot look at creation without recognizing a Creator, and that's the way I was and my people, on my reservation. We've always understood. What we didn't know is we didn't know who God's son was. We had heard about Jesus, but that had never sunk through. But when I heard it from the way he expressed it.
Speaker 2:Anyway, one morning after living with him for a couple of weeks, I was in the shower and living in their tri-level house. I was living in the bottom level and had my own bedroom, my own shower and bathroom and I was showering. I was thinking about what he told me and I always tell people. What attracted me to what Gibb was sharing with me about God and about his son, jesus Christ, was the possibility that I could get a brand new start.
Speaker 2:Now I often thought and said well, don't you want to go to heaven? I said, well, yeah, heaven would be nice. You know, if you had a choice between heaven and hell, I would choose heaven, hell. I wasn't as scared of hell because when you live on the streets in some of our cities, living on the streets, homeless, trying to find out food to eat and where to sleep every night that's like living in hell. It just is. But anyway, I was thinking through.
Speaker 2:He told me that there was only two requirements and that first is you had to acknowledge that you were a sinner. I didn't have any problem after being homeless and being a vagabond and doing all the things that homeless do people an alcoholic to find something to drink, to find something to eat, something to sleep. You know, you're willing to steal, to do whatever you have to do, and that's the type of guy in life I was living. So I thought about that. But he told me, in sharing the gospel with me, about God and about his son, jesus Christ, who died on the cross for every human being on the planet. That began to make sense to me. I was always been a logical man. I know there was only one set of human beings. There's only one race. There's only one earth. There's only one people. There's only one God. It's no more complicated than that. I've always known that.
Speaker 2:But anyway, I was sitting in the shower and he said that you first have to acknowledge that you're a sinner. I didn't have any problem with that. I knew that I was a bum, I knew that I was a drunk, I knew that I was a sinner. I was tired of being a drunk, I was tired of being a bum, I was tired of stealing, tired of living the life that I had to live in order to survive every day. And I thought you know, gibb told me that if I would repent, if I would come to God and ask for forgiveness, that he would grant me forgiveness, and that was the first step on a direction where I could live a life and get a brand new start Again. The byproduct of that I got to go to heaven, which was great, but more important to me was the possibility, after screwing up my life for 21 years, to becoming exactly what I never wanted to become, and that was nothing but a drunk Indian.
Speaker 2:I was interested in the concept of this that Christ died on the cross for my sins, all the sins I committed. And Gibb told me. He said you know, bruce, that every sin that you committed up to age of 21, if you're willing to acknowledge those and repent from them, god will forgive them. He said, but let me tell you what's more important Not only will he forgive those sins, that he would forget them. I said you mean to tell me that God would actually forget everything I've done and he would give me a brand new start? He said absolutely, if you repent from your sins, and then the next step is you have to ask his son, jesus Christ, to come into your heart.
Speaker 2:I said well, that doesn't make any sense to me, but I was showering. I had shampoo in my head, I had real long hair and I processed in my mind, you know, and I thought, okay, god, you know, I'm going to do a gift, I'm going to take a chance, you know, I mean, I should have been dead at that point anyway. And you know, if God is willing to give me an opportunity to have a brand new start, I'm going to take it. I said so. I rinsed off everything and I stood with my water running on my head and I closed my eyes and I looked up to heaven as I thought that's where God was.
Speaker 2:I said, god, I'm a sinner, I'm just a drunk, I'm a bum. Every bad thing you think. I've done so many things wrong and I'm truly sorry about that. If you would be willing to forgive me, I promise you, I take the best chance I can to never do I would change my life. Give told me that when repentance, what repentance means is you literally change the direction. You might be headed south and you turn around and you head north. You might be headed west and you turn around and head east. It's a complete change your life. I said that's what I want, god. I'm tired of being a bum, tired of being a drunk, tired of being a thief and all the stupid things that drunks and alcoholics and homeless people do. I said, if you'll forgive me, I want to ask for forgiving.
Speaker 2:I said now this next step, that gives said I have to personally. Nobody can do this for me. I have to ask Jesus Christ to come into my heart. It didn't make sense to me. I told Gibbs that doesn't make sense. How can Christ come into my heart? He's a spiritual being. I've always known that I was composed of two entities and each individual is. We have a physical body, but we also have a spiritualness that God blew into us, the breath of life that he blew into Adam.
Speaker 2:So I said, okay, father, I've asked you for repentance. I've repented of my sins. I've asked you to forgive me. I want to change directions. Now I'm going to ask you. And I said, okay, god, I don't have any faith to believe that if I ask Jesus, he'll come in. That doesn't make sense to me. But Gibb said I have to have faith. I said so, god, not only am I going to ask Jesus to come in, I'm going to ask that you give me the faith to believe that Jesus is going to come in, I said, because I don't have any. It doesn't make sense to me. So I stood in that shower that morning 50 years ago, bowed my head. I said, father, I've repented of my sins, I've asked for forgiveness, and now I'm going to say this sentence that Gibb told me to say. I said, god, would you allow your son, jesus Christ, to come into my heart and to cleanse me and to reside in me and give me a whole new direction of life into eternity and head towards hell? And I prayed that and I said Amen.
Speaker 2:Nothing happened. I thought, well, I thought I was going to hear angels sing and they weren't singing. And I thought, maybe bright lights. There was no bright lights and I said, huh, that's interesting. And so I opened the shower door to reach for a towel. And as I reached for a towel, I looked at my hand and I wasn't drunk, like I told you, and I'm not proud of that, but that's why I had the shakes really bad, until I could get a beer to drink and calm down. I looked at my hands. I flipped them back over and both hands were as steady as can be. I thought, huh, I wonder if God can cure alcoholism on the spot and I never went to detox. He just literally cured me of my alcoholism on that spot.
Speaker 2:So I grabbed a towel and I started to dry off with the towel. Of course my skin was brown. Towel. And I started to dry off with the towel, of course my skin was brown. And as I dried my arm down I looked at it and I thought dang. I thought when I become a Christian I was going to turn white. But my brown skin stayed. And I took my hand and ran through my hair and it was real long. I said I'm faith. You wash day. You know, I still know my language.
Speaker 2:And I said the craziest thing 50 years ago I wonder if God saves Indians. I mean, that thought hadn't occurred to me before. I wonder if he can save me. I think he did. And I thought about drinking. And I looked at my hands and there was no shakes. For the first time in years and years I had no desire to drink alcohol.
Speaker 2:I thought, man Bruce, maybe you're a Christian. Maybe God saved you. Maybe what Gibbs said was right. Maybe God did forgive you. Maybe he erased that blackboard that you had of all those bad things you'd done. He wiped it clean. And not only did he wipe it clean, he threw those sins away that he doesn't even remember them. And I thought this is really crazy.
Speaker 2:So I dressed up. I heard Beth, his wife, say Bruce, breakfast is ready, come on, we want to pray. I said I'll be there in a minute. So I ran upstairs real quick and they said let's pray. I said, well, first I've got to tell you something. And they said what are you going to tell us? I said, well, I think I'm a Christian. And they jumped up and they said what do you mean? So I gave them All the sins I committed in 21 years, the drunkenness and everything else, all the bad things I've done, and I think he forgave me. And then I asked God to give me not only Christ to come into my heart, but to give me the faith to believe. I just needed a little bit of faith. I think God gave me that faith to believe and I'll be honest with you, it was just a little bit of faith, because I still was wondering did this really happen, bruce? And I said I think it did, because my hands don't shake anymore, I don't feel like drinking, I don't have a desire to get drunk anymore, and I told them that Of course they started crying and hugging me and their kids hugged me they had two kids at the time and he ran upstairs and he grabbed this New American Standard Bible, this hardbound.
Speaker 2:He come back and he was been waiting for that moment. I think he said, bruce, this is God's Word right here, this is God's living Word. He said every answer to every problem you have for the rest of your life is found in this book, right here. All you got to do is sit down and read it. I took it from him and I thought this is crazy. I mean, I had never read the Bible before meeting Gib and he had shown me in our discussion for a couple of weeks and my anger and frustration, different verses, but that one verse kept sticking in my head. For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever. And I thought to myself I wonder if I'm a whosoever, I must be a whosoever. And Gibb said you are a whosoever, bruce. God saved you and now you're headed down a new path. I always tell people that when I know you're not supposed to make deals with God. I didn't know that at the time, but I told God, if you'll forgive me of my sins, if Jesus will come into my heart and if you'll take me into heaven and head me towards eternity, I'll spend the rest of my life working for you. I'll go where you want me to go. I'll say what you want me to. Guess I didn't understand the concept of preaching, but I'll be willing to tell my story, what you did for me, as long as I'm alive. And that happened 50 years ago.
Speaker 2:So since then, six months later, I found myself at Oklahoma Baptist University. I hitchhiked from Portland, oregon, down to Shawnee, oklahoma. I was never a really stupid guy If I could quit drinking. I was a pretty good student and they let me in under. I'd been to a year of college and had done really well the first semester. The second semester I dropped out because I was drinking and doing too many drugs and stuff and so I dropped out. But I had good grades, so they let me under probation in there and it was just crazy.
Speaker 2:A couple weeks later I said well, I find I give to them. I need to go to church somewhere, and I thought so. I started looking and I saw this church in the yellow pages. It said First Indian Baptist Church, shawnee, oklahoma, and I thought well, if there's Indians there, I'm going to go down there. So I, the pastor was a guy named Jimmy Anderson, so I went down there there and I walked to the door with long hair, levi's and t-shirt and Levi jacket that's all I owned, and a few clothes I bought in six months that Gibb had helped me buy.
Speaker 2:I'd worked a little bit, gone to a semester of college, junior college in Portland Oregon, and done real well and started school there. And he said well, bruce, have you been baptized? I said, well, gibb mentioned baptizing, but he was a Lutheran. He said we sprinkle water on you. And he said and he didn't quite explain it the way Jimmy Anderson said well, bruce, baptism is the first step that you have to take in your life and you have to admit that you were a sinner and that God had saved you and you're really to be publicly saved. He explained it to me. I said well, that's fine, he said, but we dunk people in the water. I said that's fine, it doesn't bother me. So, anyway, I mean long story short, the next Sunday I brought clothes, he baptized me and we went to dinner afterwards, you know, and I thought this is crazy. And he had the certificate and he said here, bruce Plummer is now an official member of the Southern Baptist Convention. He's a Southern Baptist and belongs to the First Indian Baptist Church of Shawnee, oklahoma. I said what does that mean? He said, well, you're a Southern Baptist. I said, what does that mean? He said, well, you're a Southern Baptist now because you were baptized. I said I'm a Southern Baptist. Is that a denomination or what is that? I didn't understand. He explained it to me. I said, well, okay. So anyway, I went to college To make a story short, got out of college, went to California for a little while, couldn't find work because all I studied was Bible, because I was reading the Bible every day and I still remember, probably five years after being saved.
Speaker 2:I was always frustrated with what the United States government did to my people and I guess I had unforgiveness in my heart. I finally said, okay, god, I forgive the government for what they did to my people. And I guess I had unforgiveness in my heart. I finally said, okay, god, I forgive the government for what they did to my people. I'm sorry that I'm so bullheaded and I've been harboring that unforgiveness in my heart and I know it's no good, so I need to get rid of it. So would you help me forgive the American government for what they did? And all of a sudden, I felt to myself that God was saying Bruce, welcome to my world. I said you mean, I'm actually a christian god. And he didn't talk anymore, that that I get to go to eternity and and you forgive me. And and from that point on, I was able to sing the national anthem in church. I I refused to sing it for the first four or five years of my, my christian life because I just couldn't believe it.
Speaker 2:Now, all of a sudden, I became a proud american. I was proud to be a us citizens. I was proud to be a US citizen. I was proud to be a tribal citizen. In the government my government, on my reservation we had a dual citizenship. I was a full-blooded Indian living on a reservation, a tribal member, but I also now was an American citizen. I was proud of both of those.
Speaker 2:Anyway, went on I started a church at Riverside Indian School Riverside Indian College excuse me, riverside College, a Southern Baptist school and I started an Indian church there that's still functioning, to my knowledge, to this day. And then I moved back to California and for the next 20-some years I was a bivocational pastor. I was educating the Bible, but I didn't have quite all the things. I didn't go to seminary or anything like that, but I just had a wife and I had a family and I started growing and maturing and had to take care of them. So I worked full-time but I pastored churches or I preached. I started as a youth director for a number of years in several different denominations, but I always came back to the Southern Baptist because that's where I was licensed to preach and ordained as a Southern Baptist minister.
Speaker 2:So, anyway, for the next 20 years, but I just felt, I guess, kind of an emptiness. I always wanted to go back to my home reservation, to reach my people, to tell them my story, because the concept of what God did for me, nobody could take that away from me. That belonged to me. I was there. It's as real today, 50 years after it happened, as it was 50 years ago. I remember the smell of the soap, the shampoo, the feeling of water. Everything is just absolutely crystal clear in my head.
Speaker 2:And I remember reading the Bible that my obligation as a Christ follower was to tell the great mystery of what God can do for every one of us if we're only willing. So that's what I was studying, that's what I was learning, that's what I was preaching. I would tell my story over and over and over again. This is what God did for me. I don't care if you believe it or not. I was cured of my alcoholism on the spot. God sent me and allowed me to go to a Bible school to learn the basics of Bible. I wasn't a great preacher, but I knew my story and I knew what God. And God told me that I whether I was a pastor or whether I was just a normal everyday Christian, I had the obligation to tell what God had done for me. And so my commitment to God. I said if you save me and if you forgive me, I'll spend the rest of my life, and so I've been doing that for 50 years.
Speaker 2:So about 23 or 24 years ago I was pastoring three churches and working a full-time job, and so on Sunday morning I was a circuit preacher. I would travel 30 miles one direction. I was a circuit preacher. I would travel 30 miles one direction to preach in a small rural church in a small community away from where I lived and then I'd make it back for the 11 o'clock service in the big church that I pastored and then after lunch I would go to the reservation and I had a church there that I would preach at 2 o'clock, 2 or 2.30. And that depends where I got there in the afternoon. And I did that for five years and I kept wanting to go back to my reservation.
Speaker 2:I went to listen to a conference that Henry Blackaby was speaking at and at that conference Henry Blackaby convinced me. He told me that, bruce, he said the next great spiritual awakening is going to begin with America, is going to begin with the indigenous people. And I was going to go there and say I don't know you, mr Blackaby, I've gone through your Bible study, experiencing God, and absolutely loved it. I said but you're mistaken, our people are too small in numbers, we're too insignificant, we're too poor, we're too uneducated and to make it happen. But at the end of that sermon he preached on Nehemiah. At the very end of that service, I said okay, god. I went forward and I knelt down in front of Henry Blackaby and I asked God for forgiveness for not realizing that. I believe that I'm bought into this.
Speaker 2:That radically changed my life, because I understood, yes, that could happen. It's amazing to me, as I look back at my life, how I've seen that God uses the small, the poor, the insignificant to get his work done. And it just I felt really bad that I had it took so long over 25 years for me to realize that. So, anyway, I went back and I changed my ministry. I resigned the three churches I was preaching at. I resigned as a. I was a director of this large truck shop and a food feed store and I moved back to my home reservation and I've been out here for 22 years working.
Speaker 2:I didn't start a church. I came back just because I wanted to reach my people with the gospel of God is what I wanted. I wanted to explain to them that there is only one God, there is only one earth, there's only one people. It's no more complicated than that. And so, to make a long story short, we didn't start a church. But there was a church here, a Southern Baptist church, that the pastor died real suddenly, and I had cousins that went there. They asked me to preach if I would fulfill and help bury him, and I did that and it just kind of grew, that church took off and then the tribal government asked me if I would open a campground on the southern part of the reservation in the mountains. And they said they would give me the land, they would give me a home site lease and they would do my sewer and my water, but they wouldn't build my home. That's up to me. But they gave me this 40 acres to build a youth camp on. They were trying to get youth to work with kids. So I to build a youth camp on this. They were trying to get youth to work with kids. I said, well, I've always loved kids. I've been a youth director among my pastorates in my time in the ministry. So we came out here and the bathroom worked and we got the well going and today, after working for 17 years, I opened this camp up 17. Well, this will be our 18th year. So it will be 17 years ago our 18th summer, we started having youth camps in our ministry.
Speaker 2:I started a church in an urban area working with homeless Indians, like I was at one time in the second largest city in Montana, and I've been doing that for seven years now. I travel over there on Thursday evenings and we do what's called Fry Bread Fellowship Ministries and fry bread is something that is a bread that Indians all across North America know what it is. We make fry bread and we make soup and I get to share the gospel of God and I get to tell my story and help convert my people to what God had done for me and lead them to the Lord. I've had individuals who would go to powwows, would pick up trash, would give out free water, free prayer, and we share the gospel. I could tell you hundreds of stories and one particular young man, a Hispanic man, was actually at this powwow on the Crow Reservation and my people were working with him. They shared the gospel with him and they finally, in exasperation, they came and said Bruce, we can't get him to pray.
Speaker 2:So I went down there and I asked him what was going on and I, exasperation, they came and said Bruce, we can't get him to pray. So I went down there and I asked him what was going on. And I asked him well, why are you here talking to us right now? He said I don't know. I said well, I know. He said how do you know what I'm here? I said I know you're here talking to my people. And now I'm here talking to you for one reason because God's extending the gospel of God to you. He, he's given you an opportunity right now.
Speaker 2:So you know what we said. You know that you were a sinner. He said yes, you know you have to repent. He said, yes. I said you know you have to have Christ to come into your heart. He said yes, I know that too, but I just don't know if I want to do it right now. I said well, that's the end of the story. I can't tell you anymore. God loves you. You're here talking to me and my people. I'm here standing here saying I'm going to ask you one more time Jose, do you want to accept Jesus Christ as your favor?
Speaker 2:His little girl was about 10 or 12 years old, was standing behind him, tears were running down her eyes and she was clasping her hands and she had her head praying. She was praying for her dad in silence and he looked up to me after about two or three minutes. It seemed like an eternity. He said yes, sir, I want to do this. I want to ask Christ. We prayed with him on this spot and welcomed him into the kingdom.
Speaker 2:I can tell you story after story where God has worked just like that in my life. It's been amazing to me how, if you, people will go out there and just tell what God did for you, that's all you have to do is tell your story what God has done, what the Bible has done for you, what Christ has done for you, what the Holy Spirit has filled you, how God has used you. If you would do that, they tell me that 90% 7% of the believers in America never tell their stories. That's our problem. We need to get out there and just do the simple thing Share with what God's done for you, like God's done for me. After 50 years, I have a camp that's 380 acres. We just finished our largest youth camp. We had 325 people. These past two weeks we had 27 young adults and children accept the Lord and be asked to come to the kingdom. He just continues to bless our ministry.
Speaker 1:Praise the Lord. Praise the Lord. I love it, bruce, I love to hear it. And you're right, the power is in the gospel, the power is in telling the story, the Spirit of. God anoints our testimonies, and we shouldn't be afraid or ashamed to tell people what God has done in our lives, that's right.
Speaker 1:He blesses those testimonies, he blesses the gospel message, right? Well, brother, I appreciate you telling your story. I'm just sitting here, transfixed, I'm just amazed to hear what God has done in your life and through your life. And it's been a fun ride, hasn't it, brother?
Speaker 2:And I tell you what my youngest daughter asked me the other day. She said Dad. She said when are you going to retire? I said retire. I said I'm 71 years old. I said there's no word in the Bible that says I can retire. She said well, that's exactly what I thought you were going to say Dad, I love you and thanks for all you taught me.
Speaker 1:So it's amazing, brother. God's given us a commission and we have to fulfill that mission until the very end. Right, you and I will be preaching and teaching and sharing the gospel until the very end, until he calls us home. That's exactly right. I understand that Well, you're listening to More Than Medicine. I'm your host, dr Robert Jackson. My guest today is Bruce Plummer, a missionary to the American Indians, and I hope you all will be praying for Bruce. He has an amazing ministry out there in Montana, right, Bruce?
Speaker 2:That's correct. God's blessed me way beyond my wildest imaginations.
Speaker 1:All right, well, thank you for listening. I'm your host, dr Robert Jackson. We'll be back again next week on More Than Medicine. May the Lord bless you real good.
